Jihadist Rule On Killing Women and Children part 2

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These questions were asked under a blog entry where the writer of the blog claims that American snipers, shot a child in the stomach and his intestines came out. I am always amazed at the garbage they come up with that is suppose to be true fact. And the actual facts on the ground. I never got an answer on how they knew it was a US sniper that shot the child. I do know that our snipers are highly trained, they can hit a target from unbelievable distances (like a mile plus) and they don’t shoot children.

During the Vietnam war, there were many soldiers killed because they could not shoot kids. Not because they weren’t allowed to defend themselves, but because they just couldn’t do it. So they want me to believe that a sniper, shot some kid just for the heck of it. I don’t think today would be any different than back in Vietnam, even if a kid were running up on them with a gun or bomb or something, our troops would die before pulling the trigger. We can see here, what he thinks of our facts.

Eagles comment:

You seem learnedly(yes it is a word), can you answer these questions for me??

What do you think about the 500 killed in Iraq by 3 suicide truck bombers??  (Remember, the village that was attacked was between 2 Sunni villages, and the Sunni’s had told the people in the village that was bombed to leave.)

I thought it was against the rules to kill women, children and the elderly??

What do you feel were those peoples crimes??

How does the Mujaahideen justify the killing of women and children??

I have been trying to find where it is written, that this is OK, do you know??

Jihadist comment:

Eagle, All we say to you is: Prove that the Mujaahideen, more specifically the Islamic State of Iraaq, carried out that operation. And no, I don’t want Western sources because it has been proven way too many times that they lie regarding the operations of the Mujaahideen, and are very quick to point fingers at them.

Give me the source/statement where a Jihaadee group said they did such an operation. You will come to realize that your media (the Western media) will spoon feed you lies upon lies. And you’ll be even more surprised to find out that your army (the US army) carries out such operations…some Western reporters, have reported on this cruelty. ((really?!?!?)) ((I would be really surprised, since the news media sets upon any possible bad news, with joy, especially if it paints the war in a bad light)) It is a well-known tactic in US military history called, “False Flag Operations.” America has a long history of it; google it. (())

I want to add here, this is what happens when you have people like Alex Jones and other idiots that want so bad to have democrats in office, that they make all kinds of baseless accusations. It is then vomited back up and used for propaganda by our enemies. This fool acts like he watches the “View”…google it, give me a break. America has a long history of false flag operations…can you give me some examples of false flag operations?? Since we have a long history of it you should have no problem with giving me some examples……Nothing

Eagles comment:

Are you saying that all the suicide bombings at various locations around Iraq, are not Mujaahideen??

And you didn’t answer my question about when it is OK to kill women and children. I ask because, from what I have read from your Holy books, killing women, children and elderly is not permitted.

However, I am no scholar when it comes to Islam. That’s why I am asking you. You seem to be learned, so I thought you might know.

Jihadist comment:

No, did I say that?

The Mujaahideen do confirm martyrdom operations when they do it; but if they don’t confirm the ones in the marketplaces (i.e., the ones that the Americans do), (( he wrote that not me)) ((my thinking is, if they had any proof at all, that America was doing any “false flag” operations at all, they would be SCREAMING it from the rooftops, not, as they say, not giving a crap)) then we don’t give a crap what the media says because we trust the trustworthy ones (( )) over the liars and disbelievers.  ((more oxymorons, or just morons, trustworthy murders??))

The general principle is that it is forbidden to kill women and children. There are exceptions to this principle such as if a child or a woman is fighting in the army.

It appears to me that the enemy is ALL, troops, whether Sunni or Shiite.  ALL Shiite’s whether men, women, or children.  Since they don’t have an answer on women and children being murdered, they claim that the Mujaheddin, didn’t do it.  

Eagles comment:

I’m still not understanding, about the women and children rule…sorry…Do you know of the exceptions to the rule?? It seems that there should be more than just if a woman or child is fighting in the army.

With the martyrdom operations that have taken place in various places, a lot of women and children have been killed. So I was wondering what all the exceptions were.

You appear to be one of the main writers of this blog, and have a lot of information, so I thought you would know that too.

Jihadist comment:

Let me make this clear: whenever an explosion happens in a marketplace, don’t ever expect the Mujaahideen to do such an operation since, most of the time, it kills Sunni Muslim women and children intentionally. ((and we all know that Shiite women never go to marketplace)) Therefore, don’t even allow the idea in your head that the Mujaahideen would do such an operation because they all came to fight the Crusaders, her allies, and whoever the enemies are. Men have traveled thousands of miles to Iraaq to give up their lives nobly; not to kill people who have nothing to do with the enemies.

Just to interject here, I wonder how crushed this guy would be, if he found out the truth of the matter. I am sure he will say they were apostates of some matter, as you will see below. And in case you are wondering he uses the term “Islamic State of Iraaq” all the time. What he is referring to is the parts of Iraq that are Sunni and go along with Al Qaeda. That is the theme with these guys, you have to be Sunni and believe like the Taliban . Now back to his comment.

Again, you cannot make this general statement that “wherever the martyrdom operations occur, women and children are killed…” because you cannot prove that the Mujaahideen did those operations in the first place. America wants you to believe that they did it, but have you ever thought about what the Mujaahideen say?

Can’t say that I have. But I do know that you level a whole lot of accusations at American troops without one ounce of proof. Such as this post for example, of a sniper shooting a boy in the stomach. Got any proof?? NO,…but I am suppose to believe you because…..

Alright moving on, here is a comment by another Jihadist:

Eagle, did you see what had happened to that little boy? HIS INTESTINES ARE COMING OUT!!!!!!!

No American or British child has complained of such. If it happened, none of them are denied medical care to alleviate it. That kid in IRAQ IS GONNA DIE FOR NO CRIME OR SIN AT ALL! If he hasn’t already!

Muslims fighting in Allah’s way avoid women and children, especially so children since women might join the fight. Ask that sniper about killing kids, maybe he can tell you about!

Yeah!!, nothing like a little self righteous indignation. Too bad he doesn’t get worked up by the untold numbers of Iraqi’s murdered by his friends. Sorry pal I have a hard time buying it.

Eagle’s comment:

Why is it that when you see something that is purported to be the act of an American, you take it at face value. But when I ask about the scores of women and children killed in Iraq by IED’s and suicide bombings, I am told that the Mujaahideen didn’t do it.

How do we know that the child was shot by a military sniper??

I was not there so I don’t know who did it, but it seems a bit suspicious that all those killings that are taking place over there, only have to do with the Mujaahideen when it falls under certain guidelines. That is why I asked about the guidelines on killing women and children. All I know is what I had been told, that it was against Allah to kill women and children. And all (so and so) said was if they were in the army…Surely there are no little kids in the army.

He also tells me of a book I could read. Where can I get this book?? I asked (so and so) because he writes the majority of the stories on this website and I thought that since he knew so much about Islam, he would be able to answer my question. Can you answer my question??

I can tell you that ANY child or person who is in a life or death medical status, will be helped at a US field hospital. Once they are out of life threatening situation, they are transferred to Iraqi hospital. Also, some children who have had medical problems that are too advanced for Iraqi or military hospitals, have been flown to American hospitals for advanced treatments.

Also the US military hospitals treat all injuries caused by the US military. Even when a case seems to be hopeless, the medical personnel put as much effort into saving enemy life, as in saving soldiers lives.

As I am sure most of you have already figured out, that last comment of mine was promptly erased . Can’t have any truth up at that website, now can we. In a different post, they show the murder of a Iraqi citizen. Here we see what they have to say about the video:

This video shows the Mujaahideen executing an Apostate. And all the praises and thanks belongs to Allah as our lions of Tawheed cleanse the earth from filth.

Nice guy, if he really wanted to “cleanse the earth from filth”, he had the gun pointed in the wrong direction. I asked him why he was considered an apostate…his response was:

Because he was caught working with the Iraaqi Army (who works with and supports America).

Hmmm and I thought being an apostate was about turning your back on your religion. I asked him that and if he considered anybody working in the Iraqi army an apostate, he said:

There are various nullifications of Islaam. It seems you only know one of them where if a person converted to another religion, he’s an apostate.

Another nullification is to take the disbelievers as Awliyaa’ (allies, helpers, protectors, friends) against the Muslims.

One of the evidences for this is the verse:

O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely his is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people. (5:51)

Another nullification is that if you rule a land according to laws other than the laws of Islaam, then you have become an apostate.

Needless to say, what is apostate to him, covers a multitude of people. So I said: WOW, by that, it appears there is a whole world of apostates. What will become of them??

I thought that the guys who joined the Iraqi army, did so to protect their country. Every nation needs an army, if they didn’t have one then a neighbor could decide that they should go in and take over. His reply:

Yes, there are lots of Apostates. Every Muslim Country that has an army is in actuality an army of Apostates.

As for for those who defend their nation, that is why we have the Mujaahideen. Whosoever wishes to defend their nation against foreign occupiers, must join the Mujaahideen because it is forbidden by Islaamic Law to fight for any cause except the cause of Allah; so if they fight to protect and defend Muslim countries that establish non-Islaamic laws (which is all of them today), then they are Apostates.

When I asked if the Mujaahideen would try and kill apostates he said:

Well it’s currently occurring in Iraaq, Afghanistan, Somalia, Algeria, Pakistan, Philippines, and other places.

He may not want it to get out, but it appears he answered the question from the earlier post. Maybe those women and children were killed because they were seen as being “protected” by the US military(not very well it appears). Who knows what is really going on in this idiots head.

As I was closing all my pages, getting ready for bed, I noticed another Jihadist had made a comment on the post about the murdered Iraqi citizen. It was soooo out there that I had to let you guys read it. So here it is:

The sound of that gunshot was music to my ears!
Even oppressed non-Muslims can take notes from that, and they often do the same. But if we Muslims do it, we’re labelled everything except right

 What can you say about a person like that?? Come on people, these guys are nuts. I hate to name it like that, because it is an insult to mentally challenged people or people who are truly insane.

So there is a lesson for Muslims everywhere. These same people made it real clear to me why apostate’s should be killed and I will be going over that in a different thread. But it behooves all Muslims to understand that while these radicals hate the kufar, according to them, they hate the apostate more. Shocking isn’t it. Who would have thought these guys would hate other Muslims more than they hate the infidel.

Please understand why I say the threat is just as great for the Muslim as the non-Muslim. Not only have they given you their lists of who is an apostate, but these very same people have made it known how they feel about Shiite Muslims as well.

So to recap, unless you are a Sunni fundamentalist Muslim, who believes like the Taliban, or in other words..a …. You are an apostate and should be killed.

Any questions?? Its a bleak picture I know, but one that must be listened too.

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18 Responses to “Jihadist Rule On Killing Women and Children part 2”

  1. salahudin Says:

    these are jihadists proper. i suggest reporting them to the fbi etc. i’m very serious… they show all signs of intent to aid and abet terrorists.

    and show these jihadists this pic:

    ask him if you expect such angry people to not take a bomb and blow up innocent people.

  2. Eagle Says:

    salahudin,

    You are beyond right. Most all of my “jihadist” quotes, have come from the same website. Its not like no one knows they are out there. I didn’t stumble upon them by accident. The stuff that I have printed just barely scratch the surface. They have been in action since aprox. early 2006.

    This one website puts up 1-3, or more story’s in a single day. They used to have a counter which showed the amount of people that visit their website but I don’t see it anymore. Needless to say it is a lot.

    They have a ton of people that sing their praises and the only reason they answer any of my comments, is because I practically kiss their butt (this is very difficult for me to do 😦 ) and play on their ego. If they have no answers, they just erase my comment.

    I have even seen others comment that they should provide a second address in case they are shut down. My mother is all concerned that by me going to these websites, I could be bringing eyes on me from the FBI. I told her, that is fine by me. I am a open book, I only pray that the Feds. are watching these guys.

    You can’t prove that they are planning anything, but what they are doing….should be a crime. I am sure that they are aiding and abeting terrorist, even if only by money.

    It appears to me that they don’t speak any language other than English, so that kind of limits where they are writing from.

    In my other blog, I have people wanting to know my source’s. I told them I will not give the website addresses of the radicals. Either you believe me or you don’t but I will not help these idiots gain more people to twist their mind.

    When you see how they break down a lot of the issues with the Quran and Hadiths, they make a good argument, at least to someone like me who doesn’t know any better, as far as the Quran goes. I would be going against everything inside of me to give out that information. God forbid they take a Muslim who is as naive as me, and turn them into a “better” “Muslim”

    I have all those pictures too. We already know how they feel. I pointed out in “Not Terrorist Enough” pure copy/paste of what they said. They want to be able to do more, and they will not stop until they reach their goal. And we all know what their goal is.

    It concerns me that they consider sooo many people apostates. They are firm in the belief that ALL apostates deserve nothing but death. I have some very good friends and family members that would fit into that category. Including YOU. I don’t even see them killing non-Muslims the way they do the apostate. You would think they would be on the top of their very long list.

    Do you have IM on your computer?? Let me know and I will add you to my friends list. Take care of yourself, and what ever country you are in…BE CAREFUL!!

  3. Eagle Says:

    Nothing like blithering on. You would think I could make a simple answer in the comment section. ROFLMBO 😀

  4. salahudin Says:

    lol. you should be able to see my email address in the comments section of your dashboard. email me there and we’ll exchange IM ids

  5. mohamed Says:

    The Quran does not even label other monotheist as infidels like the jurist do. This is because 95% of Sunni and Shia jurisprudence is dependent on the hadiths attributed to the prophet centuries after his death. In fact both the Shias and Sunni disbelieve in each others’ hadiths and call them fabrications. The prophet only left behind him the Quran. It must be the supreme authority and not what men said 2 to 3 centuries later about what the prophet said or did.

    Lets look at the Quran:

    The Quran(Koran) Concerning other monotheist faiths:

    Not all of them are alike; a party of the people of the Scripture stand for the right, they recite the Verses of God during the hours of the night, prostrating themselves in prayer. They believe in God and the Last Day; they enjoin good and forbid wrong; and they hasten in good works; and they are among the righteous. And whatever good they do, nothing will be rejected of them; for God knows well those who are God fearing. 3:113-115

    And there are, certainly, among the people of the Scripture, those who believe in God and in that which has been revealed to you, and in that which has been revealed to them, humbling themselves before God. They do not sell the Verses of God for a little price, for them is a reward with their Lord. Surely, God is Swift in account. 3:199

    Verily! Those who believe and those who are Jews and Christians, and Sabians, whoever believes in God and the Last Day and do righteous good deeds shall have their reward with their Lord, on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve . 2:62

    Say: “O people of the Scripture : Come to a word that is just between us and you, that we worship none but God, and that we associate no partners with Him, and that none of us shall take others as lords besides God. 3:64

    And they say: “None shall enter Paradise unless he be a Jew or a Christian.” Those are their (vain) desires. Say: “Produce your proof if ye are truthful.”Nay,-whoever submits His whole self to God and is a doer of good,- He will get his reward with his Lord; on such shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve. The Jews say: “The Christians have naught (to stand) upon; and the Christians say: “The Jews have naught (To stand) upon.” Yet they study the (same) Book. Like unto their word is what those say who know not; but God will judge between them in their quarrel on the Day of Judgment. 2.111-113

    If any do deeds of righteousness,- be they male or female – and have faith, they will enter Heaven, and not the least injustice will be done to them 4.124

    The Quran(Koran) Concerning freedom:

    2:256 There is no compulsion in religion, for the right way is clearly from the wrong way. Whoever therefore rejects the forces of evil and believes in God, he has taken hold of a support most unfailing, which shall never give way, for God is All Hearing and Knowing.

    16:82 But if they turn away from you, your only duty is a clear delivery of the Message .

    6:107 Yet if God had so willed, they would not have ascribed Divinity to aught besides Him; hence, We have not made you their keeper, nor are you a guardian over them.

    4:79-80 Say:’Whatever good betides you is from God and whatever evil betides you is from your own self and that We have sent you to mankind only as a messenger and all sufficing is God as witness. Whoso obeys the Messenger, he indeed obeys God. And for those who turn away, We have not sent you as a keeper.”

    11:28 He (Noah) said “O my people! think over it! If I act upon a clear direction from my Lord who has bestowed on me from Himself the Merciful talent of seeing the right way, a way which you cannot see for yourself, does it follow that we can force you to take the right path when you definitely decline to take it?°

    17:53-54 And tell my servants that they should speak in a most kindly manner. Verily, Satan is always ready to stir up discord between men; for verily; Satan is mans foe …. Hence, We have not sent you with power to determine their Faith.

    21:107-109 (O Prophet?) ‘We have not sent you except to be a mercy to all mankind:” Declare, “Verily, what is revealed to me is this, your God is the only One God, so is it not up to you to bow down to Him?’ But if they turn away then say, “I have delivered the Truth in a manner clear to one and all, and I know not whether the promised hour is near or far.”

    22:67 To every people have We appointed ceremonial rites which they observe; therefore, let them not wrangle over this matter with you, but bid them to turn to your Lord. You indeed are rightly guided. But if they still dispute you in this matter, `God best knows what you do.”

    24.54. Say: “Obey Allah, and obey the Messenger. but if ye turn away, he is only responsible for the duty placed on him and ye for that placed on you. If ye obey him, ye shall be on right guidance. The Messenger’s duty is only to preach the clear (Message).

    88:21 22; And so, exhort them your task is only to exhort; you cannot compel them to believe.

    48:28 He it is Who has sent forth His Messenger with the Guidance and the Religion of Truth, to the end that tie make it prevail over every religion, and none can bear witness to the Truth as God does.

    36:16 17 (Three Messengers to their people) Said, “Our Sustainer knows that we have indeed been sent unto you, but we are not bound to more than clearly deliver the Message entrusted to us.’

    39:41 Assuredly, We have sent down the Book to you in right form for the good of man. Whoso guided himself by it does so to his own advantage, and whoso turns away from it does so at his own loss. You certainly are not their keeper.

    42:6 48 And whoso takes for patrons others besides God, over them does God keep a watch. Mark, you are not a keeper over them. But if they turn aside from you (do not get disheartened), for We have not sent you to be a keeper over them; your task is but to preach ….

    64:12 Obey God then and obey the Messenger, but if you turn away (no blame shall attach to our Messenger), for the duty of Our Messenger is just to deliver the message.

    67:25 26 And they ask, “When shall the promise be fulfilled if you speak the Truth?” Say, “The knowledge of it is verily with God alone, and verily I am but a plain warner.”

    The Quran(Koran) concerning justice:

    “And among His signs are the creation of the heaven and earth, and the variation in your language and your colors; verily in that are signs for those who know” (30:22).

    “Satan seeks only to cast among you enmity and hate”(5:91).

    O you who believe! Stand out for justice, as witnesses to God, and even as against yourselves, or your parents, or your kin, and whether it be rich or poor. An-Nisaa’ 4:134

    “O you who believe! Be the maintainers of justice and bearers of witness for God’s sake though it be against your own self, parents and relatives” (4:135).

    “O you mankind! We have created you from a single pair of male and female and made you into nations and tribes so that you know each other. Verily the most honored in the sight of God is the one who is most righteous” (49:13).

    O you who believe! Stand out firmly for God, as witnesses to fair dealing, and let not the hatred of others to you make you swerve to wrong and depart from justice. Be just: that is next to piety and fear God, for God is well acquainted with all that you do. 5:8

    And thus We made of you a justly balanced community that you might bear witness to humankind and the Apostle might bear witness over you. 2:143

    O you who believe, observe your duty to God with right observance, and die not except in a state of submission (to Him). And hold fast, all of you together, to the rope of God, and do not separate, and remember God’s favor unto you: how you were enemies and He put love between your hearts so that you became as brothers by His grace: and how you were upon the brink of a fire and He saved you from it. Thus God makes clear His revelations unto you so that you may be guided” (3:102-103).

    “The believers are nothing else other than brothers, Thus make peace between your brethren and observe your duty to God that you may haply receive His mercy” (49: 1 0).

    The Quran(Koran) Concerning propagation:

    Invite (all humankind) to the path of your Lord with wisdom and goodly exhortation and argue with them in the most kindly manner, for, indeed, your Lord knows best as to who strays from His path, and best who are the right-guided. (16:125)

    Had your Lord so willed, all those who live on earth would surely have attained faith, will you then compel people, against their will, to believe? 10:99

    And We have not sent you, but as mercy to all the worlds. 21:107

    A verse quoted by some is:

    5.33. The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides, or exile from the land: that is their disgrace in this world, and a heavy punishment is theirs in the Hereafter;

    You however must look at the verse before it:

    5.32. On that account: We ordained for the Children of Israel that if any one slew a person – unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land – it would be as if he slew the whole people: and if any one saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of the whole people. Then although there came to them Our apostles with clear signs, yet, even after that, many of them continued to commit excesses in the land.

    And the verse after it:

    34. Except for those who repent before they fall into your power: in that case, know that Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful

    And also the general guidance in the Quran about when the prophet and his companions were prescribed to fight

    2.190. Fight in the cause of God those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.

    2.191. And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.

    2.192. But if they cease, God is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.

    2.193. And fight them on until there is no more Tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in God. but if they cease, Let there be no hostility except to those who practise oppression.

    2.194. The prohibited month for the prohibited month,- and so for all things prohibited,- there is the law of equality. If then any one transgresses the prohibition against you, Transgress ye likewise against him. But fear God, and know that God is with those who restrain themselves.

    was hoping you present a balanced approach and not a sectarian one by relying on the Quran as the supreme authority in Islam and not the hadiths where the clerics get their jurisprudence. The prophet is not alive to dispute what they said about him but he has sacrificed his life to leave us the Quran. The least we can do is afford him some respect and fairness.

    Islam is peace

  6. Eagle Says:

    mohamed,

    Thank you for your comment.

    I was merely showing what the radicals say. I am most grateful for your list of scripture, it will help me when dealing with these people. Please continue to check out my blog and give insight as you see fit.

    The primary purpose of my blog is to inform Muslims and non-Muslims, of what the radicals say, want, and do. Their threat is to all, not just non-Muslims. I will use everything you said in my other blog, but I will post it here as well. I am by no means, an authority on Islam. But with people like you, leaving comments like this, I will learn and then I will teach. 🙂

  7. salahudin Says:

    Mohammed, that’s your interpretation and it isn’t AS theologically backed as the conservative asharri point of view which dominates the Muslim spectrum… especially the custodians of the Islamic holy sites and their counterpart scholars, all the way down to your local imaam.

    you can insist you’re right and they aren’t… but don’t expect acceptance of such claims. 🙂

  8. Eagle Says:

    OK, does that mean that I shouldn’t use his argument??

  9. mohamed Says:

    Ths custodian of the two holy shrines was there because the Bristish, and not themUslims, help him get there. Ashari point of view does not dominate Islam, it dominates the clerics. Yes my views will be accepted because its backed by the Quran and not hadiths. The Quran has told the prophet over and over again that his job is to convey the message and thats it. There are many who support my views since its based on a Quranic perspective and not hadiths that popped up 230 years and 320 years after the porphte. By then the Quran reached China and there is no dispute about it. The Quran does not need a “chain of narration” to give it validity. It has no category like “sahih”, “daif”, “mutaffaq” or “mashour” or anything else.

    You are making it sound I get my islam from a cereal box. Who the hell is Asha’ri or Maturidi or whoever. All these people popped up after Imam Al Shafi came up linked the Sunnah with hadiths about 180 years after the prophet. Its a Abbasid invention and innovation.

    Yes, I believe that Muslims if educated and informed would put their faith in the Quran and not some hadiths from Abu Huraira who only knew the prophet for less than 3 years or Ibn Abbas who was barely 15 years old when the prophet passed away yet we see them in hadiths books drop hadiths like leaves falling from a tree.

  10. salahudin Says:

    Ashari point of view does not dominate Islam, it dominates the clerics.”

    factually and academically incorrect.

    “Yes my views will be accepted because its backed by the Quran and not hadiths.”

    no they won’t, not by me or others like me… because EVERYONE makes that claim and gives their own personal interpretation… it’s only the islamic scholars who are able to give accurate and objective interpretation of islam.

    not some random person online with NO credibility.

    “You are making it sound I get my islam from a cereal box.”

    no i’m telling your islam is NOT the cereal box kind, which is the ashari kind.

  11. Eagle Says:

    mohamed

    I don’t know, but salahudin seems pretty smart, and so far I have not had anyone claim to use nothing but the Quran.
    Obviously, there wouldn’t be so much strife between the sects if they only used the Quran, but it seems that isn’t going to happen.

  12. koranist Says:

    Ask any cleric where he got death to apostates and death to homosexuals and he will tell you hadiths in Bukhari. There is complete freedom in the Quran. Salludin never knew Islam to begin with. He took it from the clerics. Like the Jews left the torah fro the Tamud, the christians rely on Paul, the Muslim now rely on hadiths. The Quran is the ultimate authority.

    Schacht asserts that hadiths, particularly from Muhammad, did not form, together with the Qur’an, the original bases of Islamic law and jurisprudence as is traditionally assumed. Rather, hadiths were an innovation begun after some of the legal foundation had already been built. “The ancient schools of law shared the old concept of sunna or ‘living tradition’ as the ideal practice of the community, expressed in the accepted doctrine of the school.” And this ideal practice was embodied in various forms, but certainly not exclusively in the hadiths from the Prophet. Schacht argues that it was not until al-Shafi`i that ‘sunna’ was exclusively identified with the contents of hadiths from the Prophet to which he gave, not for the first time, but for the first time consistently, overriding authority. Al-Shafi`i argued that even a single, isolated hadith going back to Muhammad, assuming its isnad is not suspect, takes precedence over the opinions and arguments of any and all Companions, Successors, and later authorities. Schacht notes that:

    Two generations before Shafi`i reference to traditions from Companions and Successors was the rule, to traditions from the Prophet himself the exception, and it was left to Shafi`i to make the exception the principle. We shall have to conclude that, generally and broadly speaking, traditions from Companions and Successors are earlier than those from the Prophet.

    Based on these conclusions, Schacht offers the following schema of the growth of legal hadiths. The ancient schools of law had a ‘living tradition’ (sunna) which was largely based on individual reasoning (ra’y). Later this sunna came to be associated with and attributed to the earlier generations of the Successors and Companions. Later still, hadiths with isnads extending back to Muhammad came into circulation by traditionists towards the middle of the second century. Finally, the efforts of al-Shafi`i and other traditionists secured for these hadiths from the Prophet supreme authority.

  13. Eagle Says:

    How do you figure, the Christians rely on Paul?? As a Christian, I rely on the entire Bible. I enjoy the books written by Paul, but I enjoy the entire Bible and use the entire Bible to teach me how to live.

  14. Eagle Says:

    Thank you again salahudin It helps to have someone around who understands Islam 😀

  15. koranist Says:

    Saluddin is ignorant. He thinks Dr. Rashad Khalifa started the Koranist movement. The Koranist movement was abdicated by the Mu’tazilites and even the Koranist were around from the Abbasid era. Saluddin apostated from islam and can not believe there is an alternative interpretation of islam relying on the Koran. He thought it was the cause of the problem and not solution. As far this christian with us here, i suggets you look into this:

    http://praxeology.net/unblog02-04.htm

  16. Eagle Says:

    koranist,
    So your saying you are NOT a Rashadiite??

  17. shiva Says:

    eagle

    You blocking again


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