Anti-al Qaeda Base Envisioned

Here is the second post which is connected to the last one. Again, I found this on my friends blog, thank you Stefan. It is an article from The Washington Times, the link for this story is below.  As always any thing in ((and)) is my comment on the subject. One other thing I want to say, completely off topic. I had this post already in the line up to put up. I had hoped to do some research over the last couple of days since this time of year finds most of us extremely busy until after New Year’s Day. The series I am writing on takes a lot of research to get it right and cover everything. Anyway, on Saturday I started coming down with something, now its a full on head cold. The problem is, if it goes to my lungs, I could be in serious trouble. I have a preexisting lung problem and any other insult could not only cause me to have to go into the hospital, but it could kill me.

I’m telling you all this for two reasons; Number 1 is, I will do what I can with my blogs, but you know what its like when you have a head cold or don’t feel well. 2 if I disappear for a week or so, it could be I am in the hospital, so just so you know, its not because I am quiting the blog. 

Now, on with today’s post:

   

Article published Sep 26, 2007
an article from www.washingtontimes.com

By Willis Witter

Exiled Egyptian cleric Ahmed Subhy Mansour, whose teachings have earned him dozens of death “fatwas” from fellow Muslim clerics, uses the English translation for al Qaeda — meaning “the base” — to describe a plan to defeat Osama bin Laden and other terrorists, who he says have seized control of Islam.”Suppose you have here [in the United States] a base to counter al Qaeda in the war of ideas?” Sheik Mansour asked during a recent luncheon at The Washington Times.

“You could convince a large number — millions of silent Muslims. We can convince them very easily that the real enemy is not the United States. It is not Israel. The real enemy is the dictators in the Muslim world and the culture of the Wahhabis and Muslim Brotherhood,” he said, referring to the dominant arbiters of Islamic orthodoxy in Saudi Arabia and Egypt respectively.

Sheik Mansour is the founder of a small Egyptian sect that is neither Sunni nor Shi”ite. They call themselves Quranists because they believe that the Koran represents the single authentic scripture of Islam. They especially anger Sunni Muslims by rejecting the Hadith and Sunna, purported sayings and traditions of the prophet Muhammad.

“Killing people just because they are not Muslims, they have a Hadith for this. To kill a Muslim like me after accusing him to be an ‘apostate,” they have a Hadith for this. To persecute the Jews, they have a Hadith for this.“All this is garbage. It has nothing to do with Islam. It contradicts more than one-fourth of the Koranic verses,” Sheik Mansour said. ((one-fouth Wow!))A former professor of Islamic history at Al-Azhar University in Cairo, he was expelled in 1987 as the Muslim equivalent of a “heretic” and was briefly imprisoned by Egyptian authorities. After subsequent waves of persecution, he finally fled Egypt just months after the September 11, 2001, attacks and received political asylum in the United States the next year.

More recently, in May and June, Egyptian authorities arrested five leaders of the movement, including Sheik Mansour“s brother, on charges of “insulting Islam” and began investigations of 15 others, with the intent, he said, to destroy the entire movement.

From exile in the United States, he continues to attack the Islam of bin Laden and the Wahhabi Islam of Saudi Arabia that gave birth to bin Laden”s beliefs. Sheik Mansour also attacks the Islamist vision of Egypt”s Muslim Brotherhood, a group that rejects violence but shares the goal of a theocratic nationhood under Shariah, or Islamic law.

Though illegal in Egypt, the Brotherhood is allowed to operate openly in an uneasy truce with the government. Police round up its members whenever it delves too publicly in politics — for example, by holding anti-government demonstrations. But the Brotherhood”s interpretation of Shariah provides a benchmark for Egyptian law, which is based primarily on Shariah.

“We are not against the people. We are against this culture that will produce more and more generations of fanaticism. We go to the core of this culture and prove that it contradicts the Koran,” Sheik Mansour said.

“Few Americans understand that the battle against terrorism is a war of ideas,” Sheik Mansour said. “It is a war that is very different from the military in its tactics, its strategy and its weapons.

“Suicide bombings are just one aspect of this war. They brainwash young men to blow themselves up, to kill randomly. Our mission is to convince him, to undeceive them, to convince them that what he is doing is against Islam. He will lose his life and lose his afterlife as well.”Sheik Mansour claims about 10,000 followers in Egypt who accept his teachings, many of whom are part of his extended family.“We find Islam has the same values as the West: freedom, unlimited freedom of speech, justice, equality, loving, humanity, tolerance, mercy, everything. This is our version of Islam, and we argue that this is the core of Islam according to the Koran.”  ((Somebody tell me why people like these are so feared by the powers that be in Muslim nations??))

He and his sons operate the Quranic Center in Northern Virginia, which includes an elaborate Internet site in Arabic and English. On its Web site at www.ahlalquran.com, the organization is republishing dozens of Sheik Mansour“s books and hundreds of articles he has written over the years.  ((the english version http://www.ahl-alquran.com/English/main.php))

The campaign is not without risk. One can find a sampling of fatwas, or edicts by other Muslim scholars against the Quranists, including one saying, “We have issued our commands to the soldiers of God to worship God by pouring out their blood and burning their homes.”  ((Those of you who live in the West, be grateful for your religious freedom.))

Sheik Mansour said in response: “I do not care about my safety, but I do care about my persecuted people in Egypt.”

Paul Marshall, a senior fellow at the Hudson Institute”s Institute of Religious Freedom, said arrests of the Quranists reflect an attempt by Egypt”s government to demonstrate its loyalty to Islam to fend off challenges from even more extreme Islamists who want to impose much harsher restrictions on the Arab world”s most populous nation.

“These arrests are part of the Egyptian government’s double game in which it imprisons members of the Muslim Brotherhood when the latter appear to become too powerful, while simultaneously trying to appear Islamic itself and blunt the Brotherhood’s appeal by cracking down on religious reformers, who are very often also democracy activists,” Mr. Marshall wrote in a recent edition of the Weekly Standard.

The arrests of the Quranists received a brief mention in the latest annual report on International Religious Freedom by the State Department, which noted the arrests of five Quranists and defined the group as “a small group of Muslims who rely largely if not exclusively on the Qur’an as authoritative for Islam, to the exclusion of the prophetic traditions [Hadith] and other sources of Islamic law.”

One detainee told an Egyptian human rights investigator that he was beaten and threatened with rape by one interrogator, the State Department report says.  ((This isn’t the first time I’ve heard of this kind of punishment and interrogation torture.  So here we have a man being persecuted, because he is considered a heretic towards Islam, and we have some Muslims, torturing him and others… Please somebody tell me how one man raping another, or if a man rapes a woman … how ‘Islamic’ is that??  How is torture in any form Islamic??)) 

Since arriving in the states, Sheik Mansour has held a number of academic posts. In 2002, he was a Reagan-Fascell Fellow at the National Endowment for Democracy in Washington, where he wrote on the roots of democracy in Islam.

The next year, he received a visiting fellowship at Harvard Law School’s Human Rights Program.

He also briefly met Karen P. Hughes, the undersecretary of state for public diplomacy, last year in the office of Rep. Frank R. Wolf, Virginia Republican.The meeting, Sheik Mansour said, lasted for 10 minutes, barely enough for polite introductions.

“I said: ‘Please, let me sit down with you for more time. I have big plan,” ” he recalled. But there was no follow-up.

“We need official American help for our arrested people in Egypt,” he said. “We don”t want money. We are talking about releasing our arrested people, saving the lives of scholars, bringing them to the U.S., granting them asylum to help establish this new base for moderate Islam.”

http://www.washingtontimes.com/article/20070926/FOREIGN/109260030/1003

No Compulsion…As Long As You Believe Like Me

As we are going into Thanksgiving and I am very busy during this time of the year; I was afraid I wouldn’t be able to get at least 3 posts out this week. I won’t be putting up one on the topic I am currently working on however I found this on my friends blog.  We will get back to the other series the first of the week (hopefully).  But this post and the next one is just as informative and interesting as the series we are in, so I really want everyone to read it and the next one.

This article is written by Ahmed Mansour, and tells you some of the beliefs of these people who are being persecuted for not believing the same way as the powers that be.  I am printing it in it’s entirety here, but you can also find it here. Again, thank you Stefan for printing great stuff that I can share with others. I thought it was very interesting and worthwhile reading for all. Since I have 5 blogs, what better way to get this out there.  There is a part 2 to this which I will put up by Friday or Saturday.  Actually I think this post should be the second part, but I am putting it up first.

Again remember there is no compulsion in Islam… as long as you worship and/or believe the way your told. Anything else is subject to discrimination, jail, or death. Even if, or rather, especially if, you are a Muslim in a Muslim nation. In the early 1990’s, I was invited by the Egyptian association for religious brotherhood to lecture in a church in Cairo to Muslims and Christians about tolerance. I was warned that there was a suspicious bearded man waiting for me in front of the church.We talked. He told me that he had spent two months trying to meet me. He told me that he had been a member of secret fanatic organization and was assigned to rebut my discourse, but that my words had changed his and his family’s life. He asked me to join my weekly Friday prayer meeting at my home, and if possible bring his family.

After a month they became Quranists.

Who are the Quranists?

The Quranists are intellectual Muslims who believe in Islam as the religion of freedom, democracy, tolerance, justice, peace and human rights. They fight the terrorists’ culture from within Islam, using Quran as the only source of legislation.

Why they are persecuted?

The Quranic movement started in 1979 by sincere Muslim scholars who specialized in the contradiction between the true Islam and the Culture of Muslims. Therefore they were victimized by terrorists and fanatic scholars.
Being activists for human rights and democracy, and calling for peaceful reform from within Islam, the Quranists are also victimized by the Egyptian regime.

The Egyptian regime and Muslim Brothers are against each other but are usually united against Quranists.

Brief overview of the persecution of Quranists:

The Quranists have suffered three waves of arrest; in 1987, 2000-2001, and finally the third wave starting May 28th, 2007, when five of the Quranists were arrested, tortured for 37 days, interrogated, and suffered ridiculous accusations about their faith and prayers.

Their families were also persecuted in Egypt. Some moved to Upper Egypt and some stayed indoors. The Muslim Brothers used mosques, media and the education system, as well as their control of the streets to try to tarnish the Quranists as ardent enemies of Islam.

After the Egyptian regime officially accused the Quranists of insulting Islam, fanatics used the accusation to call for the Quranists’ death.

The five Quranists have been released in October 6, 2007, after more than four months in prison. Because of torture, my brother Abdellateef had to undergo surgery in his ear. Amr Tharwat needed surgery on his leg, while Ahmed Dahmash has damage in his backbone. The persecution continues. Every week, they must go to the same prison to be interrogated and humiliated by the security services. Any time they may be arrested and tortured again. They are ordered to pray the weekly Friday prayer in fanatic mosques, and are not allowed to contact me, or to write in our site.

In this way he Egyptian regime is seeking to make an example for the rest and keep the Quranists from continuing their reform movement.

Persecution in some detail:

As an assistant professor at Al-Azhar University, the oldest and most famous religious university in the Sunni Muslim world, I wrote five books in 1985 to reform Sunni religious life.. I was accused of being against Islam because I denied the intercession of the prophet Muhammad in the day of judgment, deny his infallibility, and deny that he is the best and the master of all the prophets. In March 1987, I was fired.In November 1987, I was arrested, along with 24 of my followers, and accused of being a denier of the Sunna, the sayings and the deeds of the prophet Muhammad. The government claimed that my writing were a call for Muslims to abandon Islam. After two months I was released.

To save my life, I escaped to the United States. When I returned to Egypt in October 1988 I was again arrested, and released after two days on the condition that I not defend myself whenever the fanatics of Al Azhar attacked me. In the period 1988-1995, I was attacked so severely, and received death threats so that I asked for court protection. From January 1996 until June 2000 I worked at the Ibn Khaldun Center as a Muslim scholar and moderator of the Center’s weekly forum. The Center is run by Dr. Saad Eddin Ibrahim, the famous sociologist, and leader of the movement for human rights, civil society and liberal culture in the Arab world. As an American citizen and part-time counselor of President Mubarak, Dr. Ibrahim has had great influence in Egypt in the 1990s.

My life was in real danger after I wrote a book as a project for the Center on reforming the Egyptian education system to make it more tolerant. I was severely attacked in the Egyptian parliament.

As a result of problems between Dr. Ibrahim and President Mubarak, Dr. Ibrahim was arrested in June 2000 and the Center shut down. Since I was in serious danger, and some of my relatives had been arrested, I contacted and explained the situation to officials in the US embassy.

The security service kept us constantly in a state of terror. They arrested more members of my family in my village. Finally they arrested some of my friends who used to attend my weekly prayer at home. One told me that he expected them to arrest both of us along with more of my relatives. He said they would as usual force my friends to make false accusations about me and so I fled to the US on October, 15, 2001. (This is reviewed in the U. S Department of State’s 2002 International Religious Freedom Report)

Since coming to the U.S, I have found the same Wahabi influence, and founded the International Quranic Center, with a website, to organize Quranists.

So, we suffer the third wave of arrest.

For more details:

http://www.ahl-alquran.com/English/show_article.php?main_id=126

http://www.ahl-alquran.com/arabic/show_article.php?main_id=2048 

How could the Quranists help the U.S in this war of ideas against the terrorists?

The war against terrorism is 90% war of ideas. This intellectual war has its unique aspects and rules. The Quranists are an Islamic group capable of defending the U.S in this ideological war against terrorism. Al Qaeda and all the terrorist organizations have real power in the war of ideas.

But they cannot debate us with logic and evidence, so they resort to brute force, with government accomplices. So we are jailed, tortured, driven from out homes and made refugees in other countries. They issue fatwas calling for our death; thus proving once more that the Wahabi ideology cannot stand on its own feet, but requires the power of authorities to force it on people.

The only way to confront and defeat Wahabis is by using our ways and methods. We are Muslims, sincere about our faith and very much attached to and adhered to the Quran, and for the past thirty years, we never wavered, never retreated, we stood alone and stood firm, and despite the persecution and the lack of means, we managed to succeed in producing a genuine change in the Islamic interpretation and practices among many Muslims.

In conclusion, despite many successes, we are still victims of the Wahabi ideology and persecution of a tyrannical regime in Egypt on one hand, and a total neglect and disregard from the American institutions on the other hand.

http://www.ahl-alquran.com/English/show_article.php?main_id=2614

See :

Egyptian Human Rights Activist Saad Eddin Ibrahim Defies Threats, Arrests to Challenge U.S.-Backed Mubarak Government

And my next post, if you just can’t wait.  Or rather my copy/paste of Stefan’s post lol.  Oh well, it is a holiday after all. 

More On Different Views Among Muslims Or The Case For Quran Only

More On The Differing Views Of Muslims magnify

  

I know we are in the middle of a series, but I am not prepared for my next post just yet.  I have been saving this one for a while now, even though I wanted to put it up some time ago.  As we have seen over this series there are many different views amongst Muslims.  Between Shia and Sunni, they don’t even have the same Hadiths, which in fact brings me to this post.  There are many questions to my Muslim friends and this post is primarily for them, but everyone should find it informative and interesting.     

This post is dedicated to at least two people whom I have the pleasure of calling friends.  As I have said many times, not every Muslim believes the same way.  There are some who believe in using only the Quran, and that is what this post is about.  I hope you will find it as fascinating as I did, whether you be Christian or Muslim.  I would ask Muslims to read and consider what they have to say, it makes a lot of sense.  

There is another group of Muslims who only look to the Quran called Rashadiites or those who believe in whatever  Rashad Khalifa has to say.  According to what I have been told, they base all their beliefs on what one mans ‘interpretation’ of the original Quran Arabic, and they even leave out some verses (at least that’s the way I understand it). Knowing some of their belief, even I, who doesn’t know much, think its a stretch.  You can read more about it/them here and here.  That is not what I am referring to here, not all Muslims who believe in using only the Quran are Rashadiites.

I will be giving you Stefan’s blog address later in this post, but first let me put in my two cents worth.  One of his most recent posts, was titled, “Critical Thinking A Right (and duty) Of All Muslims”.  I have to agree with him, as it is something that is taught in Christianity as well.  As I have stated before, you must study the scriptures for yourself, if you don’t and merely believe whatever is told to you; You could end up in some death cult like Jim Jones.  

We have gone over many things when talking about Islam and their prophecy.  One of the interesting things is that neither the Mahdi nor Dajjal is mentioned in the Quran, though Gog and Magog is.  We discussed Sufyaani, and when looking at that, it appears that the fight was going to be between Shia and Sunni’s.  My concern is those who want to rush what they see as prophecy, whether it is or not, be it Christian or Muslim.  Some Sunni’s believe that the Shiite Mahdi, is actually Dajjal.  Can you see where I am going here??

I have seen numerous Muslims attack Judaism and Christianity based on those religions placing higher value on their priest’s than on God.  But by the same token, I have seen that the other way around too.  Personally I think that when things get out of balance you need to get back to basics.  When you know that different sects believe differently only because of the Hadiths, well then I have some questions of my own, and I’m not even Muslim.  Did you know that there are Hadiths saying that Muhammad forbid people from writing down what he did??  I didn’t until recently.  What the Hadiths are, is basically that, the words and deeds of Muhammad’s life.

Among the books of hadith regarded as ‘Sahih’ (verified to be authentic), we read the following:

Abi Said Al-Khudary said that the prophet said : “Do not write down anything from me except the Quran.”

[Sahih Muslim Part 18, page 229, also Ahmed, Vol. 1, Page 171]

Abu huraira said that the prophet said, “The ‘Ummam’ (nations/peoples) that preceded you have gone astray when they wrote books and upheld them besides God’s scripture”.

(Ahmed Ibn Hanbal).

The same message is documented in other Islamic references of repute:

Abu Huraira said : The messenger of God came to us while we were writing his sayings and said: “What is it you are writing?” we said “sayings (hadith) we hear from you messenger of God” he said, “A book other than God’s book?” then Abu Huraira said, “so we gathered what we had written and burnt it all”.

(Taqyeed Al-Ilm, by Al-Khateeb Al-Baghdady) also (Oloom Al-Hadith, by Ibn Salah).

I asked my friend about this and how so many can ignore it, when so many others follow nothing but the Hadiths.  His answer was this;

“according to most scholars and researchers, this hadith was specific to the time when the Qur’an was still being written. The reason behind this command was to prevent any risk of confusing the Qur’an with Hadith. However, once the revelation was completed and it was certain that no more verses were going to be descended, it was permissible; and even an obligation to write down the Hadith to preserve it throughout time, because, had the memorizers of the Hadith passed away before writing it down, the Hadiths could have disappeared.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hadith#Controversy

Surah 6

The majority of those on Earth they will lead you (Muhammad) astray because they follow conjecture and what they have found their fathers doing!

“What if their fathers did not understand anything and were not guided ?”

“Shall I seek other than God as a judge when He has sent down to you this Scripture fully detailed?” Those to whom We have given the Scripture know it is sent down from your Lord with truth; so do not be of those who have doubt. (6:114)

And the word of your Lord has been completed with truth and justice; there is no changing His words. He is the Hearer, the Knower. (6:115)

And if you obey the majority of those on Earth they will lead you astray; that is because they follow conjecture, and that is because they only guess. (6:116)

http://www.openburhan.net/ob.php?sid=6&vid=114
http://www.openburhan.net/ob.php?sid=6&vid=115
http://www.openburhan.net/ob.php?sid=6&vid=116

Those who have set up partners will Say: “If God wished, we would not have set up partners, nor would have our fathers, nor would we have forbidden anything.” Those before them lied in the same way, until they tasted Our might. Say: “Do you have any knowledge to bring out to us? You only follow conjecture, you only guess.” (6:148)

http://www.openburhan.net/ob.php?sid=6&vid=148

“No, we will follow what we found our fathers doing.”

It seems to me that so many Muslims are following the footsteps of their fathers without understanding, they are no better than their forefathers and its true and normal according to the Quran to follow others rather than God.

And if they are told: “Follow what God has sent down,” they Say: “No, we will follow what we found our fathers doing!” What if their fathers did not understand anything and were not guided? (2:170)

http://www.openburhan.net/ob.php?sid=2&vid=170

And if they are told: “Follow that which God has sent down.” They Say: “No, we will follow what we found our fathers doing.” What if the devil had been leading them to the agony of Hell? (31:21)

http://www.openburhan.net/ob.php?sid=31&vid=21

two ??

What if their fathers did not understand anything and were not guided?

What if the devil had been leading them to the agony of Hell?

Another comment by Stefan my friend on my WordPress blog, you can see where he is answering someone elses questions;

You have to understand that the verses of the Quran were used to command Mohamed and the Believers all the time, I mean when its time of peace and when its time of war. Every verse of the Quran is related to a certain specific historical incident.

The Qur’an is claimed to be the literal word(s) of Allah as passed to Muhammad. Are you denying this claim? Is the Qur’an more like the general gist of Allah? Are you not flirting with apostasy?

The Qur’an is the literal word(s) of Allah as passed to Muhammad

The Quran is a condensed non-abrogated balanced message, and at the same time its a poem, its not a 1 2 3 book and you have to read it carefully and in context.

Any verse abrogated or quoted out of context misses the whole point of the message of the Quran.

http://pressthat.wordpress.com/2007/09/22/war-in-the-quran/

http://pressthat.wordpress.com/2007/10/21/not-a-single-verse-of-the-quran-is-abrogated/

http://pressthat.wordpress.com/2007/09/22/abrogation-the-biggest-lie-against-quran/

but a lot of verses DO suit their purposes (the dehumanization and violence towards Non-believers, etc).

It is important that we study the religious texts in their proper context. When these texts are not read in their proper textual and historical contexts they are manipulated and distorted.

It is true that some Muslims manipulate some verses from the Quran for their own goals. But this is not only with Islamic texts, it is also true with the texts of other religions. I can quote dozens of verses from the Bible which seem very violent, if taken out from their historical context.

These Biblical texts have been used by many violent Jewish and Christian groups. Crusaders used them against Muslims and Jews. Nazis used them against Jews. Recently Serbian Christians used them against Bosnian Muslims. Zionists are using them regularly against Palestinians.

“How is that not supposed to reflect on the religion as a whole???”

Do not misuse or misinterpret the religious texts of other faiths in order to defame them __ Stefan

I will leave my other blogs address below so you can read more of his comments on that blog.  Also I want to encourage you to read the posts at the links he gave for pressthat.wordpress.com which is his blog.  You can find an article on that verse here the same article is also here.  In addition to that, the links for “openburhan”, are where you can find listed various translations of different verses in the Quran it is very informative. 

But I must say that if you read nothing else, or before you read any of the other blog entries of Stefan and Sukran on PressThat at wordpress,  Read thisIt is or rather shows different Hadiths that contradict the Quran.  Food for thought here, so bear with me… If I as a Christian, followed what the Bible said, and then some hundred years later or so, some book pops up that said, hey I was a disciple and Jesus said ‘this’; but that ‘this’, contradicted what I knew that the Bible said… who should I listen too??

It is my understanding that Muslims consider the Quran to be the actual word of God.  So why would it need, or should it need something else to complete it??  Do you get what I am saying here??  Please don’t misunderstand me, I am not trying to defame your religion.  Those of you who know me from my other blogs know that.  I am merely pointing out some interesting questions and asking for your opinion on it and pointing you towards something you may find challenging.  As challenging as I found it.  If you look at what he has to say, with an open mind, it makes sense.

On more comment and question.  I watched a video of a Preacher who met with and had a hour long interview with the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem.  (for those who don’t know, he would be the third highest behind the Mufti of Mecca and Medina)  During that interview the Preacher asked the Mufti if it was true that there is no compulsion in Islam.  The Mufti said it was true and they discussed it for a bit.  At this point the Preacher asked the Mufti, “If there is no compulsion in Islam, shouldn’t that apply to Muslims as well??”  Actually I think the way he put it was, “So it’s ok for Muslims to convert to Christianity?” It was one of those two comments, at any rate the Mufti was not amused at the comment and actually got angry.  I will find the video and put it up if you want to see it.  But my question is the same as his…

Shouldn’t what is written in the Quran apply to Muslims more than anyone??  And yet someone like my friend here would be considered an apostate because he believes in the Quran alone.  In Islam, changing your faith can be punished with prison or death, depending on the country you are in.  In some parts of the world, someone could come up and kill you for no other reason than you don’t believe the way they do.  Something is seriously wrong with that picture.  Why is it against the law??  Doesn’t the Quran also say that those “apostates”, will have their punishment in the after life??  So why make it a crime now??  And how can making it a crime be justified??  These aren’t rhetorical questions, I would really like an answer. 

In the West the only law we have concerning religion is that we are to be free to worship who we want and how we want, or not if that’s our wish.  Those of you who aren’t American, you do realize why America was formed??  Back in the day, those from England came to America to have freedom of religion.  The King or Queen of England was known as “The Keeper Of The Faith”, which was intertwined with the Catholic Church and then Protestant.  At the time there was no freedom of religion, wars were fought over whether the country would remain Catholic or change.  ((Historians, don’t jump on me, that was just a very small rough draft, to make a point .))  The point is, from the very beginning of America, the government was set up to keep separate religion and government so as to not have the problems that Mary Queen of Scots and Victoria were having in England, and there abouts.

Now that I’ve blathered on, , what is wrong with having freedom of religion, when even the Quran calls for it??     

As you can see, and I have said, Islam is as varied as Christianity, and at least some sects seem a bit ‘out there’, as do some of ours.  The person I have been speaking of is the one who wrote “Don’t blame the Jews” which I posted a little while ago.  I am interested in what our Muslim readers think about it.  Please comment and share your thoughts.  Please note that when going to “Pressthat” it always opens to “About Us”, but if you look on the sidebar you can find the most recent posts.

That was going to be my final thing for this post, because it is getting long, but I just had to add this last thing.  As I said, I will put my other blog address below, starting with where my friend started commenting so you can read his thoughts.  In the mean time, I have to put this last comment of his on here, since we are talking about apostates,  Hadiths and the Quran. Another thing I want to say, for all the calls for death for all who don’t believe like the Islamist…  I have had the pleasure to make friends of Muslims from all of the main sects in Islam.  We hear so many horrible things from people who claim to be Muslim, while they violate the Quran on a daily basis.  It is a wonderful thing when we have the tool you are on right now, to make friends of others from different religions and to discuss our religion, ask questions, answer questions, and all without trying to kill one another.  As long as we do that, there is always hope.  Ok time for the last comment (I promise)…  This answer is in regards to a question about the verse in the Bukhari which states; “Whoever changes their religion, kill them”.The Messenger of Allah SalAllahu alaihi wasallam said:
من بدّل دينه فاقتلوه
“Whoever changes his religion, kill him”. (Bukhari)

I believe that Islam can only be found in the Quran and the messenger’s job to deliver the message.

The teachings of the message delivered by the messenger doesn’t mention any punishments for the Apostate, because he is going to be the loser after all.

وَلاَ تَسُبُّواْ الَّذِينَ يَدْعُونَ مِن دُونِ اللّهِ فَيَسُبُّواْ اللّهَ عَدْوًا بِغَيْرِ عِلْمٍ كَذَلِكَ زَيَّنَّا لِكُلِّ أُمَّةٍ عَمَلَهُمْ ثُمَّ إِلَى رَبِّهِم مَّرْجِعُهُمْ فَيُنَبِّئُهُم بِمَا كَانُواْ يَعْمَلُونَ

And do not insult those who call on other than God, lest they insult God without knowledge. And We have similarly adorned for every nation their works; then to their Lord is their return and He will inform them of what they had done. 6:108

http://www.openburhan.net/ob.php?sid=6&vid=108

وَإِذَا سَمِعُوا اللَّغْوَ أَعْرَضُوا عَنْهُ وَقَالُوا لَنَا أَعْمَالُنَا وَلَكُمْ أَعْمَالُكُمْ سَلَامٌ عَلَيْكُمْ لَا نَبْتَغِي الْجَاهِلِينَ

And if they come across vain talk, they disregard it and Say: “To us are our deeds, and to you is your deeds. Peace be upon you. We do not seek the ignorant.” 28:55

http://www.openburhan.net/ob.php?sid=28&vid=55

وَلَا تُجَادِلُوا أَهْلَ الْكِتَابِ إِلَّا بِالَّتِي هِيَ أَحْسَنُ إِلَّا الَّذِينَ ظَلَمُوا مِنْهُمْ وَقُولُوا آمَنَّا بِالَّذِي أُنزِلَ إِلَيْنَا وَأُنزِلَ إِلَيْكُمْ وَإِلَهُنَا وَإِلَهُكُمْ وَاحِدٌ وَنَحْنُ لَهُ مُسْلِمُونَ

And do not argue with the people of the Scripture except in the best manner; except for those who are wicked amongst them; and Say: “We believe in what was revealed to us and in what was revealed to you, and our god and your god is the same; to Him we surrender.” 29:46

http://www.openburhan.net/ob.php?sid=29&vid=46

We believe that the message is the Truth and we must explain our point of view in a good manner and we have nothing to worry about from apostates but unfortunately the Bukharians who are using the name of Islam to kill anyone who disagree with their policies, exposing their man made religion is a fear for all of them, thats why they think that killing is the solution to avoid those who reject their teachings.

http://pressthat.wordpress.com/

https://eaglespearlsofwisdom.wordpress.com/2007/10/08/israel-prophecy-and-the-end-times-1/

There is an ongoing discussion here:

https://eaglespearlsofwisdom.wordpress.com/2007/10/24/the-women-with-mustaches-who-will-kill-the-mahdi-1/

Gog and Magog In Christianity 1

Gog and Magog In Christianity magnify

This post is long, but please take the time to read it all. Some of it you may know, some you may not, but considering the signs of the times, we can all use a reminder.

Both Islam and Christianity have a “Gog and Magog” in this post, I will explain what the Christian faith says about it. I will put up Islam’s Gog and Magog in the next post. There may be things that you think I have left out, trust me, I won’t leave anything out, just give me time to get everything in.

As we discussed yesterday, Ezekiel 36-37 predicts a gathering of the Jews to the nation of Israel, which will be followed by this massive invasion. For 19 centuries the Jewish people were scattered throughout the world, and until May 14, 1948 there was no nation of Israel to invade. With the nation of Israel now a reality, the stage seems set for the war that will usher in the tribulation and the rise of the Antichrist; a war that will end with the destruction of Israel’s enemies by God Himself, and lead to the signing of a peace treaty with the Antichrist.
* The rebirth of the State of Israel in the end times (both chapters)
* The return of the Jews to the Holy Land after centuries in exile (36:10-11, 36:24, 36:37-38, 37:12, 37:21)
* The rebuilding of the ancient ruins in Israel (36:36)
* The re-blossoming of desolate, desert lands to produce abundant food, fruit and foliage (36:8-9 and 36:30-35)
* The creation of an “exceedingly great army” (37:11)
Such prophecies began to be fulfilled in the late 19th and early 20th centuries, accelerated in 1948 and 1967, and continue to come to pass to this day.

This, of course, raises an intriguing question: If Ezekiel 36 and 37 have largely come true in our lifetime, isn’t it possible that Ezekiel 38 and 39 will soon come true as well??

Everyone should read Ezekiel chapters 38-39 in the Christian Bible, for a indept look at the Christian prophecy of Gog and Magog. Ezekiel 38 through 39 tells of a future invasion of Israel by a vast coalition of nations that surround it. I will post some of it here, but it would be too long to copy both chapters here. For those of you who are unfamiler with the Christian Bible, Ezekiel was a major prophet in the Old Testiment.

And the word of the LORD came unto me, saying, Son of man, set thy face against Gog, the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him, And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I [am] against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal: And I will turn thee back, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed with all sorts [of armour, even] a great company [with] bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords: Persia, Ethiopia, and Libya with them; all of them with shield and helmet: Gomer, and all his bands; the house of Togarmah of the north quarters, and all his bands: [and] many people with thee. Ezekiel 38:1-6

The NIV translation, of the same verse’s: The word of the Lord came to me; Son of man, set your face against Gog, of the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal; prophesy against him and say: ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says: I am against you, O Gog, chief prince of Meshech and Tubal. I will turn you around, put hooks in your jaws and bring you out with your whole army – your horsemen fully armed, and a great horde with large and small shields, all of them brandishing their swords. Persia, Cush and Put will be with them, all with shields and helmets, also Gomer with all its troops, and Beth Togarmah from the far north with all its troops – the many nations with you.’

What do those names mean/what country’s are they?? There are many theory’s, and I will be going over some of them here. I will also go over the main theory, or thought on who they are. Later (in future post), I will go over why it is important and what is going on in the world that points to it now.

Most of you know that Persia, is Iran, and what is the retoric going on by its President today (don’t jump the gun, I promise I will get to that). If you want me to go into more detail about why these names are the names below, just say the word and I will. But it may come later in the series as I want to get the main stuff out first.

* Gog is described as being “of the land of Magog” and as the prince of Rosh, Meshech and Tubal. Most Bible scholars believe Gog is not a name but a title, like Pharoah or Czar. He is a dictator who will hatch an “evil plan” (38:10).

* Magog = Leading Bible scholars say this is Russia and republics of the former Soviet Union. The first century Roman historian Josephus said the “Magogites” were the peoples whom the Greeks called “Scythians.” Scythians were a fierce, blood-thirsty civilization that settled north of the Baltic Sea in what is now Russia and the European republics of the former USSR.

* Rosh = Russia* Meshech = Some Bible scholars say this is Moscow, others believe it refers to Turkey

* Tubal = Some Bible scholars say this refers to the city/region of Tobolsk in Russia along the Tobol River;

others say it refers to a section of modern-day Turkey. (Interestingly, in 1964, massive reserves of oil and gas were discovered in the Tobolsk region of Siberia and people now refer to the region as the “energy center of Russia.”)

* Persia = This was the official name of Iran until 1935

* Cush = Sudan and Ethiopia

* Put = Libya, and possibly Algeria and Tunisia

* Gomer = Turkey, but also possibly Germany and Austria

* Beth-togarmah = Armenia and the Turkic-speaking peoples of Central Asia

* “Many peoples with you” who will attack along “the mountains of Israel” =

Other countries will be involved in the coalition as well, notably countries that border the mountains of Israel. This includes Lebanon, Syria and possibly Jordan.

Before puting these names off countries up, I researched it out and found that this was the overwhelming view, though there are some who disagree on one or more of the countries involved. I may get into that, given time, but right now I want to stick to the basic’s.

WHAT

Gogs Plan

38:7 Gog will build a military coalition and be prepared” to strike
38:8 Gog will deploy the coalition against Israel
39:9 Gog will use overwhelming force against Israel; he and his coalition will come like a storm….like a cloud covering the land

Gods Plan

38:2 The Lord God will bring judgment upon the enemies of Israel, beginning with Gog, the dictator of Russia
38:20 The Lord will trigger a massive earthquake in which all the men who are on the face of the earth will shake at My presence
38:21 The Lord will turn Gogs forces against one another
38:22 The Lord will subject Gogs coalition forces to:
* pestilence
* blood
* torrential rains
* hailstones
* fire from heaven
39:6 The Lord will send fire upon Magog itself and others
39:9 Israel will capture her enemies weapons and burn them for 7 years
39:12 It will taken 7 full months to bury all the bodies of Israel’s slain enemies
39:17-20 Birds and beast will feast on the bodies of Israel’s slain enemies

WHEN

38:8 Israel will be a country again and Jews will be regathered to the Holy Land
38:11, 14 My people Israel are living securely before the “War of Gog and Magog”
38:12-13 Israel will have economic prosperity
38:16 It will come about in the last days (before the return of Christ)

WHY

39:21 I shall set My glory among the nations; and all the nations will see My judgment
39:22 the house of Israel will know that I am the Lord their God
39:29 I shall have poured out My Spirit on the house of Israel

These events will not only be a judgment of Israel’s enemies in keeping with Genesis 12:1-3, in which God says those who bless Israel

He will bless, and those who curse Israel He will curse. The events will also be the beginning of a great spiritual awakening. God will literally and metaphorically shake people out of spiritual apathy and lethargy to realize there is a God in heaven. He will also shake people who are following false religions and turn them to Himself. Moreover, He will shake those who are followers of Christ but not serious about their faith. It should be noted that ours is the first generation in human history in which all the nations on earth will be able to watch the “War of Gog and Magog” unfold because of the emergence of television and satellite technology.
** Note: All verses are from the New American Standard Bible (NASB)

Verse 8 proclaims that these nations will “invade a land that has recovered from war, whose people were gathered from many nations to the mountains of Israel, which had long been desolate.” The land that is invaded can only appear to be Israel, a nation whose people have been gathering from all over the world for 50 years.

God has intended this invasion however. In vs. 16 he declares, “In days to come, O Gog, I will bring you against my land so that the nations may know me when I show myself holy though you before their eyes.” Verses 17-23 describe the exact catastrophes that will befall the invading nations. They are supernaturally destroyed and no harm is done to Israel. God will not let his people be harmed. The miraculous Six Day War of 1967 should have taught everyone that, but the world has turned a blind eye.

Ezekiel 39:9 begins the description of the aftermath. It is gruesome but also amazing in its detail when looked at in comparison to today. “Then those who live in the towns of Israel will go out and use the weapons for fuel and burn them up – the small and large shields, the bows and arrows, the war clubs and spears. For seven years they will use them for fuel. This statement is remarkable for two reasons.

First is the nature of the weapons. In the time that Ezekiel wrote this, burning weapons made perfect sense because they were made of wood. What of today’s weapons however? How do you burn warplanes and other metals? Amazingly, Russia has been using Lignostone in the production of its weapons. Lignostone “is a special kind of wood used for ‘coke breakers.’ It is stronger than steel, is very elastic… and it burns better than coal.” (90 LaHaye Are We Living in the End Times?) You can read more about Lignostone on its website at http://www.lignostone.com.

The second important part of this passage is the fact that it will take seven years to burn all the weapons. The tribulation will be seven years, so this gives us some sort of timeline with which to place this event. This event would either have to come at the very beginning of the tribulation or before to allow seven full years.

However, this event cannot happen at the beginning of the tribulation because the tribulation begins with the antichrist signing a peace treaty with Israel. This treaty is not going to immediately be broken with this battle. It won’t be until 3 ½ years that the treaty is broken.

This means that this battle occurs before the tribulation. While it is purely speculation on my part, I believe that this is the final straw that leaves everyone crying out for peace and the perfect setting for the antichrist to step in and give it to the nations.

Chapter 39 continues with the clean up of these armies that are supernaturally destroyed. Verse 12 says that for seven months people will work nonstop to cleanse the land. This isn’t hard to imagine after seeing the devastation caused by the destruction of the World Trade Center. The cleanup took longer than half a year with crews working around the clock and the best equipment available. Imagine such destruction spread over forty miles, or an area the size of New Jersey .

Even after the seven month period, there will be people employed full time in cleaning up the land. Every bone will be marked and carried to the Valley of Hamon Gog, a mass grave for all the invaders. The name simply means hordes of Gog.

The reason for all of this destruction is for God to be glorified. In verses 21-22 he says, “I will display my glory among the nations, and all the nations will see the punishment I inflict and the hand I lay upon them. From that day forward the house of Israel will know that I am the Lord their God.”

After these events, the Israelites return to their native land in force. Verse 25, “The Sovereign Lord says: I will now bring Jacob back from captivity and will have compassion on all the people of Israel, and I will be zealous for my holy name.”

Even in such destruction, God has a purpose. The nations will fear Him and Israel will return to Him and their homeland. All of this could happen soon. The world situation is one where any number of Middle Eastern nations could easily lead a coalition against Israel . Israel has nothing to fear from their enemies though, because they are protected by the Lord of Hosts.

So the main thing we see here is that several nations will come against Israel and when they do, God will defend Israel. Pretty powerful stuff when you think about it. We have covered the who, what and where, but we will cover much, much, more in coming posts.

There is another mention of Gog and Magog in Revelations, which is the battle of Armageddon. I don’t believe it is ‘that’ battle, many scholars feel the same way. I totally agree with the above statement, I think that the war of Gog and Magog will cause people to be fed up, I think it will be at this time that we will see the 7 year treaty with Israel. I will get into this in more detail later. By understanding the pre-tribulation stuff, you will be able to identify what is playing out around you. We will also go over the ‘Rapture’, I know that not all Christians believe in the Rapture, but I will go over it anyway. That way, should it occur, everyone will know what it is/was.

There is more on this subject that I will be getting to, as I have already said. We will also go over the Gog and Magog in Islam, or, Yajuj wa Ma’juj. There is so much information, and how to write it, and keep it is some kind of order is difficult. I want to encourage you to let me know if there are things you want me to go over in more detail, but also keep in mind that I have left some stuff out on purpose and will address later.

P.S.(I should have put that picture up when talking about the signs. Did you get the joke??)

http://joelrosenberg.blogspot.com/2005/05/war-of-gog-and-magog-understanding.html
http://www.spreadinglight.com/prophecy/gog.html

Israel, Prophecy, and The End Times 1

Israel, Prophecy, and The End Times 1 magnify

  

Time to delve into some of the bigger issues.  From here on, it is very important that you read each post.  They won’t always be in order, as I will have to go back and forth, trying to keep it in some order without giving it away to soon.  I won’t be leaving anything out, so as before, give me time to get it in first.  Also, understand that everyone doesn’t believe the same way and I will be going over some of that as well. 

When you talk about the End Times and prophecy, there is one prophecy that can’t be left out.  We have already talked about a lot and we have lots more to go over but for today we will look at just one.  The State of Israel.  I know that most, if not all Christians know of this prophecy but for the benefit of those that don’t, and in addition to what the Bible says about Israel, I have put up some of what the Quran says. There will be more on this subject in future posts, as Israel is a prominent player in all Abrahamic faiths.

And the LORD shall scatter you among the nations, and ye shall be left few in number among the heathen, whither the LORD shall lead you.  And there ye shall serve gods, the work of men’s hands, wood and stone, which neither see, nor hear, nor eat, nor smell. But if from thence thou shalt seek the LORD thy God, thou shalt find [him], if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul. When thou art in tribulation, and all these things are come upon thee, [even] in the latter days, if thou turn to the LORD thy God, and shalt be obedient unto his voice; (For the LORD thy God [is] a merciful God;) he will not forsake thee, neither destroy thee, nor forget the covenant of thy fathers which he sware unto them. Deuteronomy 4:27-31

And it shall come to pass in that day, [that] the Lord shall set his hand again the second time to recover the remnant of his people, which shall be left, from Assyria, and from Egypt, and from Pathros, and from Cush, and from Elam, and from Shinar, and from Hamath, and from the islands of the sea. And he shall set up an ensign for the nations, and shall assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.  Isaiah 11:11-12

For, lo, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will bring again the captivity of my people Israel and Judah, saith the LORD: and I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it. Jeremiah 30:3

For, behold, in those days, and in that time, when I shall bring again the captivity of Judah and Jerusalem, I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for my people and [for] my heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted my land. And they have cast lots for my people; and have given a boy for an harlot, and sold a girl for wine, that they might drink.  Joel 3:1-3

In that day will I raise up the tabernacle of David that is fallen, and close up the breaches thereof; and I will raise up his ruins, and I will build it as in the days of old: Amos 9:11

For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land. Thus saith the Lord GOD; In the day that I shall have cleansed you from all your iniquities I will also cause [you] to dwell in the cities, and the wastes shall be builded. And the desolate land shall be tilled, whereas it lay desolate in the sight of all that passed by. And they shall say, This land that was desolate is become like the garden of Eden; and the waste and desolate and ruined cities [are become] fenced, [and] are inhabited. Ezekiel 36:24,33-35

I found Israel like grapes in the wilderness; I saw your fathers as the firstripe in the fig tree at her first time: [but] they went to Baalpeor, and separated themselves unto [that] shame; and [their] abominations were according as they loved. Hosea 9:10

One basket [had] very good figs, [even] like the figs [that are] first ripe: and the other basket [had] very naughty figs, which could not be eaten, they were so bad. Then said the LORD unto me, What seest thou, Jeremiah? And I said, Figs; the good figs, very good; and the evil, very evil, that cannot be eaten, they are so evil. Again the word of the LORD came unto me, saying, Thus saith the LORD, the God of Israel; Like these good figs, so will I acknowledge them that are carried away captive of Judah, whom I have sent out of this place into the land of the Chaldeans for [their] good. Jeremiah 24:2-5

The fig tree is used by Hosea and Jeremiah to refer to the Jewish people.

Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer [is] nigh: So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, [even] at the doors. Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.  Matthew 24:32-34 

Israel the fig tree has put forth its leaves and been reborn as a nation therefore the coming of Christ draws near.  Luke 21:32 also states that a generation would not pass.  A generation is between 70-100 years, Israel was established again on May 15, 1948.  Jews are still immigrating back to Israel from nations far and wide, just like the Bible said they would.  Now lets look at what the Quran has to say about Israel.

2:47 Children of Israel! call to mind the favour which I bestowed upon you, and that I preferred you to all other nations. 2:122 O Children of Israel! call to mind the favor which I bestowed upon you, and that I preferred you to all other nations. 7:137 And We made the children of Israel, who were considered weak (and of no account), inheritors of lands in both east and west, – lands whereon We sent down Our blessings. The fair promise of thy Lord was fulfilled for the Children of Israel, because they had patience and constancy, and We leveled to the ground the great works and fine
buildings which Pharaoh and his people erected (with such pride). 17:104 And We said thereafter to the Children of Israel, “Dwell securely in the land of promise”:
10:93 We settled the Children of Israel in a beautiful dwelling-place, and provided for them sustenance of the best: it was after knowledge had been granted to them.

20:80 O ye Children of Israel! We delivered you from your enemy, and We made a Covenant with you to give you the right side (the blessed side) of Mount Sinai, and We sent down to you Manna (special food) and quails.

26:59 Thus it was, but We made the Children of Israel inheritors of such things (the promised land)

45:16 We did aforetime grant to the Children of Israel the Book the Power of Command, and Prophet hood; We gave them, for Sustenance, things good and pure; and We favored them above all other nations.

44: 32 And We have chosen them (the Children of Israel) above the ‘Alamîn (mankind, and jinns) and our choice was based on a deep knowledge.

32.23] And certainly We gave the Book to Moses, so be not in doubt concerning the receiving of it, and We made it a guide for the children of Israel.
[32.24] And We made of them Guiding Lights and leaders to guide by Our command as they were patient, and they were certain of Our communications.

[17:100-104]”To Moses We [Allah] gave nine clear signs. Ask the Israelites how he [Moses] first appeared amongst them. Pharoah said to him: ‘Moses, I can see that you are bewitched.’ ‘You know full well,’ he [Moses] replied, ‘that none but the Lord of the heavens and the earth has revealed these visible signs. Pharoah, you are doomed.'” “Pharoah sought to scare them [the Israelites] out of the land [of Israel]: but We [Allah] drowned him [Pharoah] together with all who were with him. Then We [Allah] said to the Israelites: ‘Dwell in this land [the Land of Israel]. When the promise of the hereafter [End of Days] comes to be fulfilled, We [Allah] shall assemble you [the Israelites] all together [in the Land of Israel].”“We [Allah] have revealed the Qur’an with the truth, and with the truth it has come down. We have sent you [Muhammed] forth only to proclaim good news and to give warning.”

Ha, bet you didn’t know that the Quran also prophesied that the Jews would return to Israel in the last days too, did ya .  Sometimes I really wonder about what people like Bin Lyin, who professes to be so pious, and yet would like nothing more than to kill every Jew in Israel.  I wonder how he gets around the fact that Allah said that the Jews were suppose to re-control Israel.   No doubt he probably thinks that the reason the Jews were brought back to Israel was so that they were centrally located so they can be killed .  I’m sure that this one little paragraph will be enough to cause me all kinds of grief .  If I was smart, I would erase it… be gentle with me please .

There are Muslims who have no problem with Israel, probably because of what the Quran says.  There are others, which we will be getting to, who feel otherwise. There is also more on Israel that we will be getting to, so no worries, I haven’t forgotten anything…yet.  I’m sure you’ll let me know if I do.    One more thing, can any of my Muslim readers tell me who the ‘We’ is, in your scripture??  When referring to Allah, it says ‘we’ a lot, and I was just wondering who the ‘we’ is.  Is it trying to say that Allah has a wife?? I firmly believe time is short and am trying to get this stuff out as fast as I can, as it is extremely important for all faiths and non-faiths to see.      

http://www.templemount.org/quranland.html

Muslim Signs Of The End Times (Minor)

Islam's Signs Of The End Times (minor) magnify

  

Time for some of the Muslim signs of the End Times.  I hope I can do it justice, since I am not as familiar with Muslim signs as Christian signs.  As before, some things will be left out to be given their own post in order to compare text better.  Which is the purpose of this series.

When Muslim speak of the End Times, they use the word Qiyamah which means “Day of the Resurrection” which is the last judgment in Islam.  Belief in Qiyamah is part of the creed or Aqidah, and is a fundamental tenet of faith in Islam. The trials and tribulation associated with it are detailed in both the Quran and the Hadith, as well as in the commentaries of the Islamic expositors and scholarly authorities, who explain them in detail. Every human, Muslim and non-Muslim alike, is held accountable for his or her deeds and are judged by Allah according to the Quran 74.38. Al-Qiyamah is the 75th sura of the Quran. 

Basically some of the premise is the same, they believe in a final judgment.  We will be going over some of the difference in more detail in future posts.In my research I have found many links to one person, so I will use his stuff as well. 

Islam has both minor and major signs of the Qiymah/End Times, I will start with the minor signs.  We will look at some of these more closely in future posts.  As you can already tell it is a very involved process.  I had wanted to prepare the series in advance but that was not practical, so I am doing it as we move along, and trying to keep it in some order.

1.The dark of night will not be deemed necessary for the commitment of sins.
2.Extravagant mansions will be constructed.
3.Singers will be considered respectable.
4.War shall be prevalent .
5.Gambling will be prevalent.

6.People will fear living in their own houses.
7.Dajjal shall come and shall have one eye (anti-Christ) (we will get into this later) 
8.Land shall be turned into deserts
9.Earthquakes and Volcano’s and other natural disasters shall be common.
10.Good deeds will be few and far between.

11.False guides will mislead the multitudes.
12.Posts will be many, but practical teachers a few.
13.Mosques will be decorated profusely but urge towards adoration will be absent.
14.The rate of accidental deaths will be on the rise.
15.The rich will become godless and the devout will become sinful.

16.Leaders of opinion will be corrupt and overbearing.
17.False witnesses will be accepted and true ones rejected
18.The Quran will be considered as an old ancient book
19.A person spending money on sinful purposes will not be criticized.
20.People will thrust their personal opinions in the religion.

21.Usury (Interest) will be considered lawful.
22.The virtuous will be despised for their faith in God.
23.Human beings will be followers of selfish desires.
24.Pride will be taken for oppressive tendencies.
25.Good people will observe silence due to fear of wicked persons foul speech.

26.Tale bearing and backbiting will be considered as good and will be prevalent.
27.A wealthy person will command more respect then a pious person.
28.Children will curse their parents and will pray for their early death.
29.Payments will be taken for rendering religious services in Mosques.
30.There will be two eclipses in the Month of Ramadan.

31.Recitation of the Holy Quran will be considered as a burden
32.Homosexuality will be prevalent
33.The land will crumble and sink thrice in the East, the west and Arabian peninsula

– These are some of the signs.
– Most of these signs have occurred, some did not occur, and some are occurring
– May Allah protect us from hell fire.
– Please pray for the hastening of the reappearance of Imam.

Hassan Tabatabai

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Minor Signs of Qiymah by Mohammed Ali Ibn Zubair Ali (try saying that 5 times real fast)

“Qiyamah will come…

When it will be regarded as a shame to act on Quranic injunctions.

When untrustworthy people will be regarded as trustworthy and the trustworthy will be regarded as untrustworthy.  

When it will be hot in winter and vice versa.

When the length of days is stretched, i.e. a journey of a few days is covered in a matter hours.

When orators and lecturers lie openly.

When people dispute over petty issues.

When women with children come displeased on account of them bearing offspring, and barren women remain happy on account of having no responsibility of offspring. 

When oppression, jealousy, and greed become the order of the day.

When people blatantly follow their passions and whims.

When lies prevail over truth. When violence, bloodshed and anarchy become common.

When immorality overtakes shamelessness and is perpetrated publicly.

When legislation matters pertaining to Deen is handed over to the worst elements of the Ummat, and if people accept them and are satisfied with their findings, then such persons will not smell the fragrance of Jannat.

When the offspring become a cause of grief and anger for their parents.  

The following is part of a lengthy Hadith narrated by Hadhrat Abdullah Ibn Mas’ood (R.A.) I would like to ask my Muslim readers what the R.A. stands for.

Music and musical instruments will be found in every home.

People will indulge in homosexuality.

There will be an abundance of illegitimate children.

There will be an abundance of critics, tale-carriers, back-biters and taunters in society.

People will establish ties with strangers and sever relations with their near and dear ones.

Hypocrites will be in control of the affairs of the community and evil, immoral people will be at the helm of business establishments.

The Masjid will be decorated, but the hearts of the people will be devoid of guidance.

The courtyards of Masjids will be built beautifully and high mimbars (pulpits) will be erected.

Gangsters and evil people will prevail.

Various wines will be consumed excessively.

Auf bin Malik (R.A.) says: I came to Rasulullah while he was in his skin tent during the Tabuk expedition. He said to me, “Count six things before the advent of Qiyamah:

1  My death

2  The conquest of Jerusalem

3  Mass deaths amongst yu people, just as when sheep die in large numbers during an epidemic

4  Abundance of wealth to such an extent tht if a person were to be given a hundred Dinars he will still not be satisfied

5  General anarchy and bloodshed, that no Arab household will be spared from it 

6  Then a life of peace as a result of a peace agreement between you and the Banil Asfaar (Romans) which they will break and attack you with a force consisting of eighty flags and under each flag will be an army of twelve thousand men.” (Hadith: Sahih Bukhari)

Iraq and Syria

Abu Nadhrah says: “We were sitting in the company of Jabir bin Abdullah (R.A) when he said: ‘Soon the people of Iraq will neither receive any food nor any money.’ We asked, Why would such a thing happen? He replied, ‘Because of the non-Arabs.’ (i.e. they will prevent food from going into Iraq, in the form of ‘sanctions’ to this day.) He then said: ‘Soon the people of Shaam (Syria) will neither receive any money nor grain.’  We asked as to why this would happen. He replied: ‘Because of the Romans (Christians)’.

Conceited people:

Hadhrat Abbas (R.A.) narrates that Rasulallah has said, ‘Islam will spread far and wide, across the seas. Horses will cross the land and seas in the cause of Jihaad.  Then a time will come wherein a group of people will emerge which recites the Quran. 

They will claim,We have recited the Quran and is there anyone who understands the Quran better than us?  There is NO ONE more proficient than us in the study of the Quran.

Then Rasulallah asked the Sahaba, ‘Do you see any good in their claims?’ The Sahaba replied, ‘No’. Rasulallah said, ‘But these conceited claimants will be from my Ummah and will be the fuel of the Fire.’

From “Signs of Qiyamah” By Mohammaed Ali lbn Zubair Ali

http://www.islam.tc/prophecies/qiyaam2.html 

Take some time and see how many you can find that match up to Christian signs.  Monday, we will get into some of the prophecy’s I have left out.

  

Christian Signs Of The End Times 2

Christian Signs Of The End Times 2 magnify

  

Matthew 24:3 And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us when shall these things be? and what [shall be] the sign of thy coming, and the end of the world?

OK, time for part 2 of Christian signs.  Again, they are not in any order and are not complete.  The ones omitted here will be added later.

False Christs, Prophets, and their cultic groups: The Falling Away 

And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here [is] Christ; or, lo, [he is] there; believe [him] not:  For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if [it were] possible, even the elect.  Mark 13:21-22  You can also find it in Matthew 24: 4-5 and Luke 21:8

How many false Christ’s or Prophets have we seen of late??  There was ‘Heavens Gate’ where they were convinced that if they killed themselves they could catch a ride on a space ship that was behind a comet.  You have to wonder why anyone would believe that.  There was Jim Jones who got more than 900 people to kill themselves and others for him.  There was David Koresh of the Branch Davidian’s who led almost 80 of his followers to their death.  Koresh thought of himself as a angel and an agent of God.  These are just 3 men who caused untold heartache to the families of the dead.  And only in the US.

Not that long ago there was a cult up in Canada where they committed suicide together, sorry I can’t think of the name right now.  There was the cult in Japan that set off gas canisters in the subway making many sick and killing some. 

The bottom line is this, any religion or religious leader who wants you to kill yourself or others in the name of that religion, should be considered suspect.  Actually you should RUN as fast as you can, away from it!!  I have already made my opinion clear on this subject, I don’t think that God wants us killing in His name.

There was a cult up in the Washington State area who poisoned salad stations in area restaurants, in order to have the population out sick on election day. Thus giving themselves the majority (saw it on court TV). And how could this section be complete without mentioning the so called Rev. Sun Myung Moon. What is up with this article?? And please don’t tell me you visit people like this. This is concerning as well, and this especially is. I could go on and on for days or weeks. But the main purpose is to point out the obvious, that we are moving rapidly towards the end. This small list shows exactly what was spoken of in the Bible, at least that is the way I see it.

The Falling Away:  “Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils” 1 Timothy 4:1  In Europe today very few go to church, and in America millions are forsaking their church’s or wandering after men who conform to this world rather than to the will of God.

Oh boy here’s some good ones

Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;  Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron; Forbidding to marry, [and commanding] to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth. For every creature of God [is] good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving: For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.  1 Timothy 4:1-5

Here is the NIV version: 

The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons. Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron. They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth. For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving, because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer.

Outbreak of demonic and occultic activity:

How many of us teach our children that this is good??  From TV to books to movies, all of a sudden its hip to be a Witch.  Speaking of Harry Potter, I wish I could find the story now, but I did hear that the number one requested book at Guantanamo is Harry Potter.  What about this, who ever heard of a Pagan pride parade??  Leave it to San Francisco.  I would be very careful dealing with this kind of stuff.  You may just end up channeling the devil himself, and he may decide to stay. Parents remember what the Bible said about training up your child in the way he should go, and in the end he will not depart from it.  What are you training your child to be??

Here is what can happen if you immerse yourself in the occult.  The Columbine High School massacre was committed by two teenager’s who were heavily involved in occult practices and Satan worship. Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold professed faith in Satan and Nazism frequently and were not taken seriously – that is until after their killing spree. Hal Lindsey, who wrote ‘The Late Great Planet Earth’, said “Satan never wanted a world that did not believe in the supernatural. He wants a religious world that will believe in Him. And for this He will supply all kinds of supernatural experiences to lure in those who reject God’s truth.”  I have to say, I agree with him.

Tribulation and Persecution of Christians: Matthew 24:8-9

Christians are under attack throughout the world today.  In the United States Christians still enjoy freedom to worship God without suffering much more than ridicule, hatred, or discrimination at work and school.  However in many other countries such as China, Sudan, Africa, Saudi Arabia, Korea, Russia, and many Muslim nations, Christian suffer much greater persecution and often times death for their faith.  During the tribulation this suffering will be worldwide and will continue even to the point of martyrdom.  There are some today calling for doing away with all religion because it is, in their eyes, the root of all fighting in the world.  

There will be even more of this during the tribulation, I will go over it in the future when we get to that part of the series. 

We have covered a lot of bad stuff in regards to the Christian signs, but there is also some good, so lets get some of that now.

The Outpouring Of The Holy Spirit and The Gospel Preached Through out the World

And it shall come to pass afterward, [that] I will pour out my spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions; And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out my spirit.  Joel 2:28-29

And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.  Matthew 24:14  also Mark 13:10 says: And the gospel must first be published among all nations.

This isn’t new, its been going on for quite some time.  And it has done great in keeping our kids interested in God and Church.  It seems to me that the youth movement in the Christian faith has really taken off some years ago, an appears to be continuing today.  When I was a kid, it wasn’t nearly as big, there wasn’t much in the way of others to socialize with at school.  Everyone knows how huge peer pressure is, so the fact that our youth today have so many of their peers to look up to is great.  Some communities even have Churches geared towards youth alone.  I would encourage them to go to Church with their parents, but if not, then by all means, go to the youth Church. 

And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.  Matthew 24:14 

This prophecy has already been fulfilled through television, radio, missionaries, the translation of the Bible into many languages, and the Internet.  People all over the world now hear the message of Christ from missionaries who have the means to travel the globe, and via technology that allows us to communicate with people on the other side of the world right from our own homes, churches and offices.

Increase of Knowledge – The Prophet Daniel was instructed that in the last days knowledge and travel would greatly increase: “Be thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased” (Daniel 12:4) It is evident that in the past century both education and travel have exponentially accelerated. In 1991 Knowledge doubled every 10 years.  It now doubles every 22 months.  

Billy Graham was quoted as saying, “ninety percent of all the engineers and scientists who have ever lived are alive today.”  Air travel, space travel, DNA research and human cloning are all examples of the rapid increase in knowledge in our generation. 

OK, so far we have covered the following: 1) Wars and Rumors of War; 2) Famine; 3) Pestilence/Plague; 4) Earthquakes; 5)  2 Tim 3:1-5 which is a whole list of stuff; 6) Fearful and Great signs and sights from the heavens; 7) The Falling Away; 8) False Christs Prophets, and their cultic ways; 9) 1Tim 4:1-5, another list; 10)  Outbreak of demonic and occult activity; 11) Persecution of Christians; 12)  The Out pouring of the Holy Spirit; 13) The Gospel preached through out the world; 14) Increase of knowledge;

Please let me know if you want me to go further on any of these subjects. I’m saving some of the best for latter.   

My next post I will write some on Islam’s signs of the end times.  Then we will start on the good stuff.